Why don't................

[Clark Griswold]

..............the Atheists ever have anything to say in this section unless the thread puts Christians in a negative light?

I mean, the church shooting thread was very busy with atheist responses, yet the one detailing Rick and Kay Warren's ministry to inner city AIDS patients has been totally ignored, as have the threads that mentioned Christian persecutions, etc.
It's sorta puzzling, really.
If some Atheist organization were reaching out to AIDS sufferers in such a loving and helpful way, I'd dare say that our resident Atheists would be praising the organization to the high heavens.

So what's the deal--the good and humanitarian efforts of Christians and churches somehow don't "count" or something?

[Mycernius]

Seeing as I have only just joined and haven't really had a look around, I haven't read much that requires me to say much. Actually I would usually avoid this forum all together. I don't say much on AN either for News, I prefer debate, so I would be more active in the Theology fora. As for people doing good I believe you should do it for yourself, not to blow your trumpet for whatever religion of beliefs you hold. There are some very fine charities that do good, but never get mentioned in news or events because they don't need to. or just not news worthy. Plus most News focuses on the negative in life, so I try not to comment too much, only if someone says something that I find remarkable stupid or insensitive.

[Clark Griswold]

Originally Posted by Mycernius

Seeing as I have only just joined and haven't really had a look around, I haven't read much that requires me to say much. Actually I would usually avoid this forum all together. I don't say much on AN either for News, I prefer debate, so I would be more active in the Theology fora. As for people doing good I believe you should do it for yourself, not to blow your trumpet for whatever religion of beliefs you hold. There are some very fine charities that do good, but never get mentioned in news or events because they don't need to. or just not news worthy. Plus most News focuses on the negative in life, so I try not to comment too much, only if someone says something that I find remarkable stupid or insensitive.

Who said anything about blowing one's own trumpet or doing "good" so people will notice?
Your response sorta proves what I'm saying H, plus you ignored addressing the question's basis.
One of we Christians get caught screwing the neighbor's cat--it's excellent fodder for the atheists.
One of us gets killed while trying to help AIDS orphans in Africa, staffing shelters for the homeless, starting schools in various third world countries--eh, who cares?

[Mycernius]

Do you ever reply or post on positive news of non-christian organisations doing good, or is it another post or thread on some fundie blowing himself up in Iraq, attacking a non-islamic village or group? Bad news stories of any sort get more response from the people than good news stories, be them catholic priest abusing young boys, a muslim killing innocents, or even an atheist falling foul of the law. Look at the newpapers or top stories on the TV, bad news generates more interest. Says a lot for the human race, you included. Go onto the BBC news site and you'll find more bad news than good news, but not to sound to down beat, from the news today (can't post link yet)

Originally Posted by BBC News

Calendar aims to recruit priests

Father Pat Wall supports the New York Yankees baseball team
Twelve Catholic priests have swapped their pulpits for favourite pastimes in a calendar designed to try to recruit young men to the priesthood.
The priests, from the Diocese of Leeds, are pictured in an array of activities, including reading celebrity magazines, watching baseball and DIY.

Each featured priest also reveals what inspired them to join the church.

The calendar has been created as part of a drive to encourage teenagers to take up Holy Orders.

It comes as the Catholic Church faces a national shortage of people entering the profession.

The priests also say what they believe they would be doing if they were not a priest.

If I weren't a priest I'd be up to no good. Or at least more than I am already!

Father Simon Lodge

Answers to that question range from those who would have undertaken other vocational careers such as policing and nursing to those who could not dream of doing anything else in life.

October priest Father Matthew Habron, of St Austin's in Wakefield, says his childhood dream was to be an astronaut.

The calendar was the idea of Father Simon Lodge, of Myddelton Grange, Ilkley, who reveals in November: "If I weren't a priest I'd be up to no good. Or at least more than I am already!"

Human side

First priest in the calendar is Father Pat Wall, of Christ the King in Bramley, who is pictured dressed in a New York Yankees baseball top and cap and wearing a baseball mitt to represent his American nationality.

Father Eamonn Hegarty, of the Sacred Heart in Howden, East Yorkshire, is shown running in February, while March's contributor, Father Neil Byrne, of St Joseph's in Harrogate, is seen indulging in a copy of celebrity gossip magazine, Heat.


Father Neil Byrne is the prison chaplain at HMP Wealstun, near Wetherby

A spokesman for the Diocese of Leeds said: "You get up in the pulpit each week and say we need more priests but after a while the needle sticks.

"The calendar was an attempt to inspire people and recruit more priests as we are getting less and less as the years go by."

Bishop of Leeds, the Right Reverend Arthur Roche, hopes the calendar will help young men see the human side of the priesthood.

"Priests are not created out of nothing," he said.

"They come from ordinary families and they have dreams and aspirations as does every young man. They also have worries and concerns. But despite this they offer themselves generously for service in the church."

The calendar is on sale at every Catholic church in West Yorkshire, priced £4.99.

The proceeds go towards the Myddelton Grange Catholic Retreat Centre in Ilkley, which provides day and residential retreats for young people.

I'm sure if I posted up Richard Dawkins giving soup to the needed in africa you'd most likely ignore it, but if it was Richard Dawkins caught kiddy fiddling, you'd be on it like a shot.

[Clark Griswold]

Originally Posted by Mycernius

Do you ever reply or post on positive news of non-christian organisations doing good, or is it another post or thread on some fundie blowing himself up in Iraq, attacking a non-islamic village or group? Bad news stories of any sort get more response from the people than good news stories, be them catholic priest abusing young boys, a muslim killing innocents, or even an atheist falling foul of the law. Look at the newpapers or top stories on the TV, bad news generates more interest. Says a lot for the human race, you included. Go onto the BBC news site and you'll find more bad news than good news, but not to sound to down beat, from the news today (can't post link yet)



I'm sure if I posted up Richard Dawkins giving soup to the needed in africa you'd most likely ignore it, but if it was Richard Dawkins caught kiddy fiddling, you'd be on it like a shot.

Well, you're wrong on that one, fella.
Besides, a simple perusal of these threads will bear that out.

Show me an example of some atheist organization doing good for the poor or orphans or something like that and I'll applaud as loudly as you will.

[JM]

Maybe they dont wish to reply, might be as simple as that

[friendly hardline atheist]

Hello Clark,

Originally Posted by Clark Griswold

..............the Atheists ever have anything to say in this section unless the thread puts Christians in a negative light?

I mean, the church shooting thread was very busy with atheist responses, yet the one detailing Rick and Kay Warren's ministry to inner city AIDS patients has been totally ignored, as have the threads that mentioned Christian persecutions, etc.
It's sorta puzzling, really.
If some Atheist organization were reaching out to AIDS sufferers in such a loving and helpful way, I'd dare say that our resident Atheists would be praising the organization to the high heavens.

So what's the deal--the good and humanitarian efforts of Christians and churches somehow don't "count" or something?

Clark, you've been on this forum long enough to have spotted the usual way in this 'current events' section of the forum. Jon posts batches of news reports, most go without reply. At the moment of writing this post it is exactly that scenario again. Out of the 20 posts on the first page, 18 are by Jon, one by me noting the killing of Benazir Butto, and then there is yours. 16 out of these 20 are without reply from either christian or atheist. There's no more word on AIDS sufferers from christians than from the evil atheists you bemoan. This part of the forum has generally been rather quiet over the holidays anyway.

Now, your latest post is another one in what I would call the 'we poor, unjustly treated perfect christians' flavour that more of your posts have had. From the bemoaning of the tone of the atheists here in your first posts, to decrying the judicial branch for maintaining some degree of separation of church and state, or the rather less relevant praising of hospitals being set up by the church (ending with 'you're welcome' as if to say how much indebted the world is to christianity). The 'we christrians have done all the good in the world and we're being treated so badly' is one pretty effective way of making people dislike christianity and christians.

While you apparently feel like 'I'm not taking this lying down' and want to speak out, I think you're having the opposite effect of what you try to achieve. Believe it or not, I've had some interesting discussion with some of the 'old style' christians here that mostly left the forum during the mass exodus. By trying to argue their case rather than complain and whine, they were imo better ambassadors for christianity. Some of your posts are not raising respect for what you would want us to respect.

Take what I've said in this post as you like. Maybe lack of tone of voice and body language is a catalyst for a bad atmosphere. If you click on my user name you'll find my email. Feel free to drop me an email or pm to get my Skype id or phone number. Maybe it would be fruitful to have a chat sometime?

greets,
Peter

[Commodore Angryy]

It's not that at all, it's that those kind of threads don't really need responses. I mean, what could we possibly say?

"That's great" , "fantastic" , it hardly makes for an in-depth and insightful conversation.

[Gray]

Originally Posted by Clark Griswold

So what's the deal--the good and humanitarian efforts of Christians and churches somehow don't "count" or something?

No more than anyone else's, no. Compassionate and charitable works are not the exclusive domain of Christian (or any other religious) groups. There's no moral superiority to be claimed simply because you're a Christian organisation, when you're not doing anything that others don't.

Show me an example of some atheist organization doing good for the poor or orphans or something like that and I'll applaud as loudly as you will.

If you really want to put those sorts of labels on organisations, any that don't declare a religious agenda or backing should be considered atheist.

UNICEF and Medicins Sans Frontieres come immediately to mind. Do they meet your criteria?

[friendly hardline atheist]

Hello Gray,

Originally Posted by Gray

UNICEF and Medicins Sans Frontieres come immediately to mind. Do they meet your criteria?

I don't know too much about their agendas being religious or atheist. I suspect they might be more 'uninterestedly agnostic' than explicitly atheist? Amnesty International might be a better example to bring up here. When they declared it their policy to support the right to abortion for rape victims, various churches were at their throat like a pack of wolves. They immediately declared Amnesty to be an organisation with an anti-religious, secularist and even 'abortion-pushing' agenda. The Catholic church went as far as to ban all Amnesty activity in Catholic schools. If you had asked me this time a year ago I would have answered that I suspected them to be more agnostic-minded than atheist too. But their abortion policy has now firmly put them in the anti-religious camp. According to various christian churches anyway. While they may not be pursuing atheist policies for their own sake, on the subject of abortion they are working explicitly against what the christian churches are aiming for.

greets,
Peter